Infrastructure Raid Targets.

wastedfly wrote:I just wonder if anyone will do the research to actually verify my bombastic statement.

Though, I did quickly run through the list of naval powers in the last 2000 years and could not come up with anyone, so, pretty safe I would say.

How about the Japanese Navy, circa 1905. All 4 battleships at the battle of Tsushima were built in England. Japan wasn't considered a Naval force prior to 1905, but was afterwards.

JohnRoth wrote:

n7axw wrote:The subject of attacking Sol has been discussed, I think, in ART. An actual attack on Old Earth has been ruled out on the basis it would provide a powerful emotional rallying point for the rest of the League. What is a bit fuzzy in my own mind is if this includes the rest of the Sol system. For example one of the League's big fleet basis is in orbit around Mars. I am not sure that the conversation would have included that or not. But for certain, no attack on Old Earth.

Yep. While an attack on Old Earth has been ruled out, I agree that the SLN base in orbit around Mars may have a bright future as plasma.

An attack on anything in the Solar System is too risky from a PR basis. There are at least a half-dozen other major SLN reserve fleet bases, presumably with associated shipyards. Start with them. The shipyards, not the obsolete ships (leave those alone until enough work has been done to make them ready-ish for deployment). Taking out the SLN's own shipyards will leave it somewhat dependent on SDF facilities, with consequent shift in relative power.

Bill Woods wrote: An attack on anything in the Solar System is too risky from a PR basis. There are at least a half-dozen other major SLN reserve fleet bases, presumably with associated shipyards. Start with them. The shipyards, not the obsolete ships (leave those alone until enough work has been done to make them ready-ish for deployment). Taking out the SLN's own shipyards will leave it somewhat dependent on SDF facilities, with consequent shift in relative power.

I'm not going to get into an argument about raiding the Sol System anymore (except I agree with John Roth above), but your post does bring out the point of what will happen if the GA is confronted by a reasonably well-run and powerful SDF...and one perhaps sailing in formation with a BF force.

Or even if the SDF is only defending it's own system, which happens to have a major BF base that's on the list for demolition. That could be a thorny problem for the GA.

And considering that many of the MAlignment worlds (well, at least one) have a substantial SDF....that could lead to some interesting complications, don't you think?

Hutch wrote:

Bill Woods wrote: An attack on anything in the Solar System is too risky from a PR basis. There are at least a half-dozen other major SLN reserve fleet bases, presumably with associated shipyards. Start with them. The shipyards, not the obsolete ships (leave those alone until enough work has been done to make them ready-ish for deployment). Taking out the SLN's own shipyards will leave it somewhat dependent on SDF facilities, with consequent shift in relative power.

I'm not going to get into an argument about raiding the Sol System anymore (except I agree with John Roth above), but your post does bring out the point of what will happen if the GA is confronted by a reasonably well-run and powerful SDF...and one perhaps sailing in formation with a BF force.

Or even if the SDF is only defending it's own system, which happens to have a major BF base that's on the list for demolition. That could be a thorny problem for the GA.

And considering that many of the MAlignment worlds (well, at least one) have a substantial SDF....that could lead to some interesting complications, don't you think?

Definitely agree with that. Even if the GA attacks just BF/FF bases, it's still destroying the infrastructure of the system the base is in. Most of the workers on the base are probably citizens of the polity of the system. Any shipyard workers certainly, I would think, would be civilians.

On one hand the GA needs to destroy the BF/FF bases and very likely go after any shipyards that can built warships, but on the other hand, this means they will be directly destroying system infrastructure that the systems needs to keep functioning. Six of one and half a dozen of the other. It's very likely that this will end up pissing off a good percentage of the population even if it removes a corrupt leader. Unless the GA comes back with lots of money to help rebuilt what it wrecked and destroyed.

The question you should ask is where is the corporate headquaters of Technodyne located.

This is a "transtellar corporation". That would be like a Milti-National on Earth now. It will have operations and offices or representivies in a lot of systems (countries) with varying levels of management working there and answering up through the corporate sturcture.

Yildun is a system that is owned by Technodyne. While it is- amoung other things- a place where major ship construction yards are turning our and repairing commercial and navel ships and we presume other manufacturing take place, it is not a sovereign system.

The nominal corporate HQ for Technodyne is going to be in a League system. Possibly one of the Core Worlds, even perhaps Earth. The challange is always going to be that once something gets this big, its like wresting with a Kraken to get even a handle on it let alone control it.

Think of Yildun as a Pittsburg or a Ruhr Valley only set in a wilderness with no nation having a valid claim to it. Major Company Town with it's own security and almost total internal contols plus very cozy relationships with all the big dogs including the SLN.

Brigade XO wrote:The question you should ask is where is the corporate headquaters of Technodyne located.

This is a "transtellar corporation". That would be like a Milti-National on Earth now. It will have operations and offices or representivies in a lot of systems (countries) with varying levels of management working there and answering up through the corporate sturcture.

Yildun is a system that is owned by Technodyne. While it is- amoung other things- a place where major ship construction yards are turning our and repairing commercial and navel ships and we presume other manufacturing take place, it is not a sovereign system.

The nominal corporate HQ for Technodyne is going to be in a League system. Possibly one of the Core Worlds, even perhaps Earth. The challange is always going to be that once something gets this big, its like wresting with a Kraken to get even a handle on it let alone control it.

Think of Yildun as a Pittsburg or a Ruhr Valley only set in a wilderness with no nation having a valid claim to it. Major Company Town with it's own security and almost total internal contols plus very cozy relationships with all the big dogs including the SLN.

Actually, that's not what the text tells us. The text says that Yildun has lots of resource but no habitable planets. It says that it has a wormhole junction with three termini, the second-oldest known wormhole junction. The text says that Yildun is at the boundary of the Core and the Shell regions of the Solarian League. It says that Technodyne of Yildun has a headquarters (possibly the primary headquarters) in Yildun. But the text does not say that Technodyne owns the system--it doesn't even tell us that Technodyne is the only transtellar corporation with a headquarters there. The text could be interpreted as implying that Yildun is part of the Solarian League. It could, in fact, be a formal member of the League, even lacking a habitable planet.

JohnRoth wrote:

n7axw wrote:The subject of attacking Sol has been discussed, I think, in ART. An actual attack on Old Earth has been ruled out on the basis it would provide a powerful emotional rallying point for the rest of the League. What is a bit fuzzy in my own mind is if this includes the rest of the Sol system. For example one of the League's big fleet basis is in orbit around Mars. I am not sure that the conversation would have included that or not. But for certain, no attack on Old Earth.

Don

Yep. While an attack on Old Earth has been ruled out, I agree that the SLN base in orbit around Mars may have a bright future as plasma.

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If the Mars yards are outside the Hyper Limit, or near it, a little judicious scouting, followed by an LAC Raid ala MacGregor System in AOV; by the way, I wonder what Audrey Pyne is up to by now ?

-- Stewart

stewart wrote:If the Mars yards are outside the Hyper Limit, or near it, a little judicious scouting, followed by an LAC Raid ala MacGregor System in AOV; by the way, I wonder what Audrey Pyne is up to by now ?

-- Stewart

I believe the text says that they Mars facility (not construction yards, as I recall) is in orbit around Mars. Mars is 12.6 light-minutes from the Sun. The hyper-limit of the Sun is about 21.12 light-minutes. That puts the facility about 8.5 light-minutes inside the hyper-limit.

SWM wrote:

stewart wrote:If the Mars yards are outside the Hyper Limit, or near it, a little judicious scouting, followed by an LAC Raid ala MacGregor System in AOV; by the way, I wonder what Audrey Pyne is up to by now ?

-- Stewart

I believe the text says that they Mars facility (not construction yards, as I recall) is in orbit around Mars. Mars is 12.6 light-minutes from the Sun. The hyper-limit of the Sun is about 21.12 light-minutes. That puts the facility about 8.5 light-minutes inside the hyper-limit.

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at MacGregor, Scotty, Harkness and company translated in approx. a light-day out and spent 2 days at minimum wedge levels building up speed then went ballistic coasting prior to launching their shipkillers at the Peep Dreadnaughts and BC's (who were at the equivalent of "cold iron").

-- Stewart

stewart wrote:

SWM wrote:I believe the text says that they Mars facility (not construction yards, as I recall) is in orbit around Mars. Mars is 12.6 light-minutes from the Sun. The hyper-limit of the Sun is about 21.12 light-minutes. That puts the facility about 8.5 light-minutes inside the hyper-limit.

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at MacGregor, Scotty, Harkness and company translated in approx. a light-day out and spent 2 days at minimum wedge levels building up speed then went ballistic coasting prior to launching their shipkillers at the Peep Dreadnaughts and BC's (who were at the equivalent of "cold iron").

-- Stewart

MacGregor didn't have much in the way of sensor networks. It'd be unwise to assume there isn't a sensor array with light-months of range, like Manticore has, somewhere in the Sol system.