HMS Duke of Cromarty

n7axw wrote:There is no textev to suggest that HMS Duke of Cromarty was involved in the BOM and I find the idea extremely improbable.

What I wonder is it survived the Yawata Strike... Is there something about that that I might have missed?

Don

Don't remember anything one way or the other. But it was almost certainly in orbit, not at one of the stations that were the primary target, so there is a good possibility that it did survive, but that is a matter of total speculation.

munroburton wrote:A few remarks in the Beowulf tactics thread about Elizabeth I not attempting to evacuate Manticore during the first Battle of that system led me to wonder what HMS Duke of Cromarty was doing during said battle.

Everything I've read says the royal yacht was a BC(P) with only a portion of its missile storage replaced. So did it fight with Home Fleet or sit in Manticore's orbit?

A third possibility is being in yard hands, similar to HMS Hexapuma.

One fine use of such a unit, compatible with remaining near Manticore as the royal escape pod, is being part of the coverage of Manticore itself against out of control or very long range missile strikes against the planet or orbital assets.

JeffEngel wrote:

munroburton wrote:A few remarks in the Beowulf tactics thread about Elizabeth I not attempting to evacuate Manticore during the first Battle of that system led me to wonder what HMS Duke of Cromarty was doing during said battle.

Everything I've read says the royal yacht was a BC(P) with only a portion of its missile storage replaced. So did it fight with Home Fleet or sit in Manticore's orbit?

A third possibility is being in yard hands, similar to HMS Hexapuma.

One fine use of such a unit, compatible with remaining near Manticore as the royal escape pod, is being part of the coverage of Manticore itself against out of control or very long range missile strikes against the planet or orbital assets.

Speculation yes, but I think we can be very sure that the HMS Duke of Cromarty survived, because RFC doesn't out out major details, such as THAT ship's destruction; he mentions several unknown ships that were destroyed. A similar argument I'd have is Elizabeth's arrival post- Yawata Strike to meet with Eloise Pritchart on Honor's ship out at Trevor's star would have been another point where David would have mentioned something like "since the destruction of the HMS D.O.C, the whereabouts of the ship acting as the Royal Yacht were kept secret and mobile to prevent another attack..."

Instead, the scene plays out with touches of sympathy and humor for the boat bay officer who didn't now that the Queen was coming, because the information hadn't trickled down far enough.

munroburton wrote:A few remarks in the Beowulf tactics thread about Elizabeth I not attempting to evacuate Manticore during the first Battle of that system led me to wonder what HMS Duke of Cromarty was doing during said battle.

Everything I've read says the royal yacht was a BC(P) with only a portion of its missile storage replaced. So did it fight with Home Fleet or sit in Manticore's orbit?

A third possibility is being in yard hands, similar to HMS Hexapuma.

JeffEngel wrote:One fine use of such a unit, compatible with remaining near Manticore as the royal escape pod, is being part of the coverage of Manticore itself against out of control or very long range missile strikes against the planet or orbital assets.

SharkHunter wrote:Speculation yes, but I think we can be very sure that the HMS Duke of Cromarty survived, because RFC doesn't out out major details, such as THAT ship's destruction; he mentions several unknown ships that were destroyed. A similar argument I'd have is Elizabeth's arrival post- Yawata Strike to meet with Eloise Pritchart on Honor's ship out at Trevor's star would have been another point where David would have mentioned something like "since the destruction of the HMS D.O.C, the whereabouts of the ship acting as the Royal Yacht were kept secret and mobile to prevent another attack..."

Instead, the scene plays out with touches of sympathy and humor for the boat bay officer who didn't now that the Queen was coming, because the information hadn't trickled down far enough.

IIRC, Honor's ship was in Manticore orbit. It had come in from Trevor's Star. So there was no need for Elizabeth to use the Duke of Cromarty to travel to Honor's ship, as it was just a pinnace ride from Manticore it self to Manticore orbit, which she would have had to do anyway, since the royal yacht can't actually land on Manticore. I can think of three possibilities as to why it hasn't been mentioned the DoC wass destroyed. First - it wasn't. Second David didn't think about it one way or the other, and is now keeping his options open for the next book. Third, David did think about it, and has something sneaky planned for the next book. At this point, if he is asked, I would expect tum-te-tum-te-tum.

--snipping--

Sharkhunter wrote:...at Trevor's star...
IIRC, Honor's ship was in Manticore orbit. It had come in from Trevor's Star. So there was no need for Elizabeth to use the Duke of Cromarty to travel to Honor's ship, as it was just a pinnace ride from Manticore it self to Manticore orbit, which she would have had to do anyway, since the royal yacht can't actually land on Manticore.

Had to reread the pertinent text again but you are right, because the pinnaces were accompanied by "atmospheric sting ships", meaning HMS Invictus had come all the way into orbit over Landing, and the HMS Duke of Cromarty wasn't even involved. I'd imagine that there was a rather interesting escort of RMN ships making sure Invictus didn't suffer a mischief on the way in, of course. There's a later quote about Pritchart's whereabouts becoming public knowledge which was where my confusion came about, thinking they'd gone back out to Trevor's Star for secrecy, proximity to Theisman's offered ships, blah blah blah.

SharkHunter wrote:--snipping--

Sharkhunter wrote:...at Trevor's star...
IIRC, Honor's ship was in Manticore orbit. It had come in from Trevor's Star. So there was no need for Elizabeth to use the Duke of Cromarty to travel to Honor's ship, as it was just a pinnace ride from Manticore it self to Manticore orbit, which she would have had to do anyway, since the royal yacht can't actually land on Manticore.

Had to reread the pertinent text again but you are right, because the pinnaces were accompanied by "atmospheric sting ships", meaning HMS Invictus had come all the way into orbit over Landing, and the HMS Duke of Cromarty wasn't even involved. I'd imagine that there was a rather interesting escort of RMN ships making sure Invictus didn't suffer a mischief on the way in, of course. There's a later quote about Pritchart's whereabouts becoming public knowledge which was where my confusion came about, thinking they'd gone back out to Trevor's Star for secrecy, proximity to Theisman's offered ships, blah blah blah.

IIRC, all the negotiating happened on Invictus to preserve secrecy. Elizabeth went up to Invictus on Honor's pinnace for the same reason.

I don't envision Invictus being escorted in at all since the impression they would have wanted to make would be "business as usual" while Prichard's presense was classified.

Don

fallsfromtrees wrote:

munroburton wrote:A few remarks in the Beowulf tactics thread about Elizabeth I not attempting to evacuate Manticore during the first Battle of that system led me to wonder what HMS Duke of Cromarty was doing during said battle.

Everything I've read says the royal yacht was a BC(P) with only a portion of its missile storage replaced. So did it fight with Home Fleet or sit in Manticore's orbit?

A third possibility is being in yard hands, similar to HMS Hexapuma.

fallsfromtrees wrote:Where did you read this - I don't remember that at all. Not doubting you, just looking for the reference.

SWM wrote:In the Pearls: http://infodump.thefifthimperium.com/en ... gton/248/1

Thank you.

There's also this, which is canon:

http://maxxqbunine.deviantart.com/art/A ... -487154356

SharkHunter wrote:--snipping--

Sharkhunter wrote:...at Trevor's star...
IIRC, Honor's ship was in Manticore orbit. It had come in from Trevor's Star. So there was no need for Elizabeth to use the Duke of Cromarty to travel to Honor's ship, as it was just a pinnace ride from Manticore it self to Manticore orbit, which she would have had to do anyway, since the royal yacht can't actually land on Manticore.

Had to reread the pertinent text again but you are right, because the pinnaces were accompanied by "atmospheric sting ships", meaning HMS Invictus had come all the way into orbit over Landing, and the HMS Duke of Cromarty wasn't even involved. I'd imagine that there was a rather interesting escort of RMN ships making sure Invictus didn't suffer a mischief on the way in, of course. There's a later quote about Pritchart's whereabouts becoming public knowledge which was where my confusion came about, thinking they'd gone back out to Trevor's Star for secrecy, proximity to Theisman's offered ships, blah blah blah.

n7axw wrote:

IIRC, all the negotiating happened on Invictus to preserve secrecy. Elizabeth went up to Invictus on Honor's pinnace for the same reason.

I don't envision Invictus being escorted in at all since the impression they would have wanted to make would be "business as usual" while Prichard's presense was classified.

Don

Except that Invictus leaving Trevor's Star to come to Manticore is unusual in and of inself. Normally Honor would have just taken one of the shuttles that were used to move between the systems.

One of the capabilities NOT listed for the current HMS Duke of Cromarty is a Marine contingent, though they would obviously have boarding and military arms for the King's Own.

Would the King's own also include Battle Armor, etc. or would they have perhaps a couple of companies of specially designated RMN marines embarked? similar to how the Secret Service guards the President but the Marine Corp flies the copters and protects Camp David, etc.

Minor unit HMS Emparoter is Honors flagship IIRC Invictus was destroyed at the Battle of Manticore where it was Home Fleet flagship.