Protector's Own - Who pays?

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:Of course the PO is funded by monies that would
otherwise go to the GSN!
How else?

markm57 wrote:[snip]
Actually I finally found this qoute from House of Steel concerning the funding to wit : "The Protector’s Own is personally financed by the Protector of Grayson".

Which still leaves me stymied as to how even Benjamin can afford it sigh.

Weird Harold wrote:
The Protector's Own seems to be somewhat similar to the US National Guard in structure; The GSN provides the hardware and the Protector provides the personnel and direction.

The National Guard is supplied and equipped out of the Regular Army's equipment budget, but the State pays for personnel and maintenance. The State remains in control of the NG except when the NG is called up for national service (eg in wartime.)

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:Of course the PO is funded by monies that would
otherwise go to the GSN!
How else?
HTM

PalmerSperry wrote:

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:Of course the PO is funded by monies that would
otherwise go to the GSN!
How else?
HTM

Only if we take the extreme POV that any money spent on healthcare and education on Grayson is money that would otherwise go the GSN? If on the other hand the Protector is funding it by levying a special tax in his steading, soliciting donations or funding it himself out of the privy purse then not really!

PalmerSperry wrote:at bottom.

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:Of course the PO is funded by monies that would
otherwise go to the GSN!
How else?
HTM

PalmerSperry (a name of a USA corporation) replied:
Only if we take the extreme POV that any money spent on healthcare and education on Grayson is money that would otherwise go the GSN? If on the other hand the Protector is funding it by levying a special tax in his steading, soliciting donations or funding it himself out of the privy purse then not really!

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:Healthcare and education??
What have they to do with it????

The PO is a GSN unit,
enlisting foreigners like the French Foreign Legion,
equipped and supplied with GSN materials
(mostly built on Yeltsin System),
and no doubt financed the way the French did the FFL.

IF the PO had not been established, the money, people,
and materials would have been put into the regular GSN.

PalmerSperry wrote:

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:Healthcare and education??
What have they to do with it????

1 I was wondering if you where taking a rather extreme (IMHO) financial position that any government money not spent on $X is money that could've been spent on $X. e.g. "IF the government of Grayson wasn't providing healthcare, the money, people, and materials would have been put into the regular GSN."

The PO is a GSN unit,
enlisting foreigners like the French Foreign Legion,
equipped and supplied with GSN materials
(mostly built on Yeltsin System),
and no doubt financed the way the French did the FFL.

2 AIUI the PO is not a GSN unit, though it obviously serves directly alongside it. To quote House of Steel "the Protector’s Own has been established as a separate service branch, legally coequal to the Grayson Space Navy ...". House of Steel also states "The Protector’s Own is personally financed by the Protector of Grayson". Finally, the story _Obligated Service_ in the short story collection Beginnings, shows that there are natural born citizens of Grayson serving in the Protector's Own ... It doesn't just take foreigners, nor for that matter do foreigners solely join the Protector's Own (e.g. Honor Harrington, Mercedes Brigham, Alfredo Yu who all joined the GSN ... Not least because the Protector's Own didn't exist at the time!)

I think a better analogy for the Protector's Own would be to say they're like the Blair Atholl Highlanders, only fully equipped and trained like a regular military unit. In fact, they seem to regarded as something of a elite, highly motivated unit that demands and gets performance higher than the regular GSN (see _A Ship Called Francis_ and _Obligated Service_ for standards that the GSN is prepared to put up with). (The best of the GSN seems to think it a point of honour to show that they're just as good, the worst of the GSN seems to think the PO are total loons who spend too much time in the simulator and/or doing live-fire exercises.)

IF the PO had not been established, the money, people,
and materials would have been put into the regular GSN.

Since the Protector wasn't pushing the money that he uses to fund the Protector's Own into the GSN prior to the return of Honor Harrington, I don't think you can demonstrable say that the money went to the PO instead of the GSN. These days you can make a case, to a greater or lesser extent, that the people & materials side of things do apply. Though would the GSN be able to afford to be bigger without the Protector personally funding the extra?

PalmerSperry wrote:

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:Healthcare and education??
What have they to do with it????

1 I was wondering if you where taking a rather extreme (IMHO) financial position that any government money not spent on $X is money that could've been spent on $X. e.g. "IF the government of Grayson wasn't providing healthcare, the money, people, and materials would have been put into the regular GSN."

The PO is a GSN unit,
enlisting foreigners like the French Foreign Legion,
equipped and supplied with GSN materials
(mostly built on Yeltsin System),
and no doubt financed the way the French did the FFL.

2 AIUI the PO is not a GSN unit, though it obviously serves directly alongside it. To quote House of Steel "the Protector’s Own has been established as a separate service branch, legally coequal to the Grayson Space Navy ...". House of Steel also states "The Protector’s Own is personally financed by the Protector of Grayson". Finally, the story _Obligated Service_ in the short story collection Beginnings, shows that there are natural born citizens of Grayson serving in the Protector's Own ... It doesn't just take foreigners, nor for that matter do foreigners solely join the Protector's Own (e.g. Honor Harrington, Mercedes Brigham, Alfredo Yu who all joined the GSN ... Not least because the Protector's Own didn't exist at the time!)

I think a better analogy for the Protector's Own would be to say they're like the Blair Atholl Highlanders, only fully equipped and trained like a regular military unit. In fact, they seem to regarded as something of a elite, highly motivated unit that demands and gets performance higher than the regular GSN (see _A Ship Called Francis_ and _Obligated Service_ for standards that the GSN is prepared to put up with). (The best of the GSN seems to think it a point of honour to show that they're just as good, the worst of the GSN seems to think the PO are total loons who spend too much time in the simulator and/or doing live-fire exercises.)

IF the PO had not been established, the money, people,
and materials would have been put into the regular GSN.

Since the Protector wasn't pushing the money that he uses to fund the Protector's Own into the GSN prior to the return of Honor Harrington, I don't think you can demonstrable say that the money went to the PO instead of the GSN. These days you can make a case, to a greater or lesser extent, that the people & materials side of things do apply. Though would the GSN be able to afford to be bigger without the Protector personally funding the extra?

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:I numbered your points for convenience.

1 No.

2 Many people have not read House Of Steel, and won't.
All data in it is alterable at the whim of DW.

As for A Ship Called Francis, it is a comedy, a satire,
a bit of nonsense, and not even a good one.
I, for one, will not accept anything in it as being part
of "the real Honorverse" until I see it quoted in a
"mainline" work by DW himself.
Perhaps this means that I need not and should not post
in this thread.

HTM

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:I numbered your points for convenience.
1 No.

2 Many people have not read House Of Steel, and won't.
All data in it is alterable at the whim of DW.

As for A Ship Called Francis, it is a comedy, a satire,
a bit of nonsense, and not even a good one.
I, for one, will not accept anything in it as being part
of "the real Honorverse" until I see it quoted in a
"mainline" work by DW himself.
Perhaps this means that I need not and should not post
in this thread.